The Third Witness: July 19, 2012

Before getting to the subject of this post, False Prophet Ronald Weinland has updated his trip itinerary as posted on his blog.  Covers every weekend for the rest of the Great Tribulation:

Mar 10 Spokane, WA
Mar 17 Cincinnati, OH
Mar 24 Windsor, CT
Mar 31 Los Angeles, CA
April 5 & 7  NEW ZEALAND
April 13 & 14 Melbourne, AUSTRALIA
April 21 Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA
April 28 Detroit, MI
May 5 Cincinnati, OH

Also scheduled but not published on his blog:
May 21 Covington, KY for federal court appearance (pre-trial conference in criminal tax matter)
(On April 21, Weinland announced that he and his wife would not actually be killed in Jerusalem.  Guess he wasn’t so sure about the resurrection thing) May 23 through May 26 Jerusalem (to lie dead on the streets before being resurrected)

Isn’t it wonderful that God is showing us so much mercy by delaying the Great Tribulation for so long?  Now back to today’s posting:

In a previous post, Fleeing to Javan, I published a slightly edited (to remove identities) email from the wife of an ex-PKG-member.  This fellow decided that he is one of the two witnesses and to split off from Ron.  Or maybe Ron just disfellowshipped him.  I believe that the picture to the right is the guy.

This is another nut with a website and also has a YouTube channel filled with uploaded screeds.  According to him, we won’t be able to relax when May 28th rolls around and Christ hasn’t returned.  Satan has perverted the Jewish calendar, and while Ron is correct about Jesus’ return on Pentecost, he is using the wrong calendar and has the wrong date.  July 19th is when the world as we know it ends.

A few selected writings:

The last enemy camp that I slumbered through was certainly by design as this was the camp of the false prophet.

I have spoken on this subject in the past and will be speaking against him in the future.

There are many false prophets, even if they do not call themselves prophets that many will turn to as the destruction intensifies.

But this man is particularly dangerous because he has prophesied the coming destruction and he claims that he and his wife are the two witnesses and people will listen to him and follow him as we go forward.

This man also speaks of living by every word of Elohiym. He speaks that you cannot pick and choose. He is right, but he is a liar and a hypocrite because he does not practice, nor teach what he preaches.

Actually, this guy claims that he is the only witness, since the other was Zerubbabel which is one of the titles that Ron claims.

The sad thing is that he has a teen daughter, and has taken his family to Greece to await the return of Christ in July.  I hope his family isn’t suffering too much from his delusion.

128 thoughts on “The Third Witness: July 19, 2012

  1. Well sure, Mal presented a convincing argument that Ron is God’s end-time prophet, pointing out fulfilled prophecies and Witness miracles which we viciously attacked.

    As another example, I refused to agree with you that Avalo was wrong about the 4th day Vs 3 1/2 day point. We are all mindless rabid Weinland haters.


  2. Actually, Mike, I wasn’t referring to you. You are usually pretty balanced. Anyway, I don’t mean attacking arguments …. that’s legit … I’m talking about attacking people … that’s not necessary and usually points to the fact that the one doing it is not able to refute the argument at hand … thus the smoke screen …


  3. So you’re saying the commenters here only have ad hominem arguments? Perhaps you have an example where a rational pro-Weinland argument resulted in a personal attack as the only defense against that argument.


  4. I have a good friend that is in PKG. I was wondering if there would be anything here to help convince her that she’s wrong. I have my answer.


  5. This is the first time I’ve been asked these questions but as a student of Logic, it’s in my best interests and everyone else’s too , if you think about it, that I keep my position on RW to myself. You see, I have read here enough over the last several months to know that as soon as a person defends Weinland in any way, he is viciously attacked and made out to be an idiot. ( example in point … Mal) After that, it doesn’t matter how logical or intelligent their words are, they are dismissed. On the other hand, a person who states that RW is a false prophet or at least has serious doubts in that regard, is stroked and loved and welcomed with open arms even if their thoughts and ideas are totally idiotic and irrelevant. They are treated as if they are the bravest and most intelligent of people and their words are accepted at face value, no questions asked. Personally, I don’t want to fall into either category. Accept or reject my words on the merit of the argument itself … not by which side of the fence I’m on.

    Well, Annon, as you can see, I asked you these questions to give you a platform – so you can point out where we are wrong. But you chose to not take the platform. I wonder why. As a student of logic I would assume it would be logical to answer these questions in a matter-of-fact way; I mean, these question are straight forward and clear as clean water, but yet no one, not one person, will answer them.

    Ok, for me, here are MY answers.

    Do you really believe that RW is a true prophet? Do you believe that his statements throughout the past 6 years have been true? Do you believe that Jesus Christ is going to return on May 27th? Can you actually listen to his “sermons” and make sense out of them? Can you list any prophecies RW has made as true? What about the statements he has made concerning “if by Pentecost if these things have not happened exactly as I said they would, I will stop preaching!”? Has he done that? Why do you choose to focus on statements that are meant to be metaphoric to show an example instead of the things RW has stated? Can you honestly say that you really believe that RW and his wife are the two witnesses of Revelation? And if so, what do you base that belief on?

    I do not believe that RW is a true prophet. It has been proven otherwise.
    I believe that his statements throughout the past 6 years have been false. Nothing has happened to make them true.
    I believe the Jesus Christ will NOT return on May 27th.
    I cannot listen to RW’s sermons and make sense out of them. In fact, I can’t stomach more than 2 minutes of listening to his blather.
    I cannot list ANY prophecies RW has made that has come true. 100% fail. A mark of a false prophet.
    No, he has not stopped preaching but has continued to try to “fool” his followers. That in itself makes him a “liar”.
    RW and his wife are not the two witnesses of Revelation as he has given proof of the contrary.

    So, I would be an idiot, based on what I have just written, to believe what he says. Based on logic. Based on proof. Based on facts.


  6. Annon, no one has any arguments that will convince a PKG member that they’re wrong. Once they’ve decided to believe what Ron says over all logic and reality, there’s _nothing_ what will counter act that. If they had decided that the sun was indeed made of orange juice, then no fact would get past that.



  7. A student of logic, and Anon has no argument for his friend of Rons validity to claim end time witness?

    I don’t suffer fools either, which is why I have nothing further to say.


  8. Annon, Ronald Weinland has made numerous *specific* prophecies (in general Ronald is too ambiguous, but some prophecies of his are not), ALL OF WHICH HAVE FAILED.

    Not only have they failed to come to pass RONALD HIMSELF has admitted that certain *OFFICIAL out of the mouth of God* prophetic statements he has made HAVE FAILED.
    If you put your bible goggles on, you would correctly translate this as an admission that he is a false prophet.

    In stating that any prophecy has failed, Ronald is making an admission he is a false prophet.


  9. MY RESPONSE: I said I wouldn’t respond out of respect for Mike. But since he has allowed this to continue then I will also comment, based SOLELY on the fact that if Mike is OK with the continuation, then I will assume he is OK with my response. Don’t confuse my respect for Mike or my attempt at be respectful for ONCE with me being a hypocrite (Jack 365/Annon).

    ANNON said: As for the “orange juice comment” … it is only relevant to the topic of Weinland IF Weinland has made statements that are as ridiculous and unscientific as the sun being made of orange juice…Weinland’s teachings cannot be compared to this foolishness. Anyone who makes these types of comparisons needs only to take a course in Basic Logic to realize this”.

    1. Ronald Weinland has stated that he is an envoy for a man in space. That is ridiculous and unscientific.
    2. Ronald Weinland has said that he has the power from a man in space to make me die. That is ridiculous and unscientific.
    3. Ronald Weinland has said that a Jewish carpenter who died 2000 years ago is going to come down from the sky on May 27th, 2012. That is ridiculous and unscientific.
    4. Ronald Weinland has said that a 200 million man army was supposed to be sweeping across the world right now because 1900 years ago an exiled guy on te Greek island of Patmos said so…because a man in space send an angel to to tell him that.


    1. My logic isn’t foolish. The comparison is sound.
    2. You are the one who “needs to take a basic course in logic to realize this”.

    That polite enough for y’all?


  10. ANNON said: “On the other hand, a person who states that RW is a false prophet or at least has serious doubts in that regard, is stroked and loved and welcomed with open arms even if their thoughts and ideas are totally idiotic and irrelevant. ”

    You call yourself a student of logic, BUT…

    1. You generalized and did not give a specific example.
    2. You attacked “a person” and not the argument.
    3. You did not give an example of the stroking or welcoming.
    4. You stated an opinion like it was an argument.
    5. You argued from emotion, not from facts. “stroked” and “loved” are not tools of logic.

    Ergo; Your claim that you are a student of logic is undermined by the fact that (1). your claim that my OJ statement was foolish is untrue, and (2) your claim that Mike or the rest of us stroke and love anyone who disagrees with RW is unproven, and (3) your inference that I haven’t taken/need to take a basic logic course is provably false.


  11. Avalo, I took it as just an comparison. I understood what you were saying. For anyone to take it any further than what you meant it to be is a foolish person.
    It really is pretty silly for anyone to try and make it anything more out of it.
    Annon or Anon is nit picking. I think trying to stir you up.
    Don’t waste your time Avalo trying to explain something so simple to someone who can’t hear.
    BTW, did Thein have a peanut butter sauce for me???? Lets face it. This is important. 🙂


  12. ANNON said (about people that defend Ronald Weinland that): “it doesn’t matter how logical or intelligent their words are, they are dismissed.”

    1. You did not give an example, and made a massive generalization about Mike. That is not ‘logical’
    2. Mike (DDTFA) allowed a MASSIVE debate between myself and a poster named “Mark” to debate in our own thread, with permission to use ad hominem attacks. That is DOCUMENTED on this blog, and is irrefutable PROOF that MIke does not dismiss any/all dissent like your statement has implied.
    3. You have not defined dismissed. Kicked off of the site? Treated badly? Ignored the logic of the defender’s statements? If you are going to be logical you must be more specific to make a coherent argument. “Dismissed” is not an ‘argument’.

    ERGO (which means “therefore”):

    1. Your statement is neither sound nor based on the facts available at this site.
    2. You once again have undermined the claim that you are a student of logic to the degree that you have successfully shown me to be “foolish”.
    3. I recommend the book “Thinking with Concepts” by John Wilson. It will help you on your path as a student of logic, and you can get used copies for cheap on


  13. Helen:

    My wife is cooking tonight with her “students”, and she is really busy, but she said she would get around to fishing out the peanut sauce recipe once she had a little free time. She is downstairs right now with a bunch of Vietnamese ladies, and they are all covered in fish sauce, but she says a very cheery and enthusiastic “Hi” from the basement.


  14. ANNON said: “You see, I have read here enough over the last several months to know that as soon as a person defends Weinland in any way, he is viciously attacked and made out to be an idiot.”

    1. “I have read enough here”. Then provide an example. You are making an a priori assumption that we all just know what you are saying to be true before the fact, thus you just “know”.
    2. “to know”. You are ‘begging the question’, assuming your conclusion in the statement. You are assuming that “the attacks” are on the fact that someone has defended Weinland when in actiual FACT, it has consistently been the logic of their defence. My proof? Read the Mark vs. Avalo” debate thread and read all the comments by Mike and myself asking mark to PROVE hat he is saying, NOT the fact that he is defending Weinland.

    3. I myself have defended Weinland here at times when I thought that it was appropriate. Your assumption that Mike and I and others have only attacked RW is a false assumption.

    ERGO; You have made claims that are demonstrably false. Your logic is not as sound as you imagine it to be. That is a fact I have proven with evidence.


  15. ANNON said: (those who oppose RW) “…are treated as if they are the bravest and most intelligent of people and their words are accepted at face value, no questions asked.”

    1. I, Avalokiteshvara, have been ‘attacked’ by others here for my manner of opposing Weinland, i.e. via my atheism. Helen/Atrocious/and even YOU have NOT accepted my words at face value. So YOU YOURSELF have proven that you claim is wrong.

    2. “No questions asked”. Mike (DDTFA) has edited out comments and entire arguments I have made many times on this blog. Mike even “threatened” to edit US on this thread! That is PROOF that Miek does not take my comments at face value. In fact, I am arguably the most edited. I have locked horns with Mike /Helen/Atrocious/Jack 365, and we have all come away with new knowledge about each other, and hopefully a new found respect for each other. That is NOT accepting my words at face value.

    ERGO: You have made yet another set of claims that are demonstrably false, as proven by the recorded history of this blog.


  16. ANNON said: “It’s interesting how you love to end certain debates that become uncomfortable for you …. speaks volumes.”

    1. I only ended the debate out of respect for Mike (DDTFA).
    2. You have no proof that I was uncomfortable with the debate. My statements were evidence of my respect for Mike (DDTFA).
    3. “Speaks volumes”. What does it say? Volumes of what? By saying that I am “uncomfortable” and thus you can surmise some sort of fear or cowardice in my response is not logic. It is an ad hominem attack. My emotional state is NO measurement for the truth value of my words. If I am sad and I say “the moon is in the sky”, am I wrong because I am not in the right emotional state for that fact to be true?

    ERGO: You have used a fallacious argument to suggest I am a coward or uncomfortable. That is failure of logic.


  17. You know what else is a failure of logic…why I continue to have these useless battles with people who love con men and their imaginary powers given to them from mystical space people.
    I have a family. I don;t need this…


  18. “useless battles “

    Yup! It’s sometimes like talking to a wall. The pro Weinlands and fence sitters are like an eight-track tape. It can play forever unless you take it out. And the songs will never change. I’ts aconstant loop.


  19. Avalo, I commend you on your control. Maybe you should have been a lawyer (if you aren’t already, j/k). I agree with what you’ve said and you know I’ve come to respect you. We are all in this together, to TRY to educate these people to who/what they are really involved in. Yes, it gets really frustrating because they “just don’t get it”. Their minds are closed to anything except the voice of ron weinland (their god). It’s like an addiction. Hang in there. When your wife is finished with her lady friends, be sure to get/give hugs from/to her and your daughters, and have a play session, or listen to some music, or whatever relaxes you.


  20. I agree Atrocious..
    Also, when Annon said her/his friend is in PKG. I think Annon is in the friend in PKG.
    I would say Avalo go eat some of that food. Yummy, I bet it is soooooooo goooooooood!!!!

    Would annon be another drive-by person?
    Talk about causing confusion, has to be a PKG-er.


  21. Where do these people come from? This guy is clearly fooled by Satan. Whether he’s delusional, or intentionally claiming this stuff, it’s from Satan.


  22. I cannot wait till our messiah returns to purge the earth of all who oppose his righteousness. Yehweh is much less concerned with doing what’s good in man’s eyes. Ron’s righteousness is like a rag covered in fecal matter. REPENT RON!


  23. And according to ron he should have already been killed in the streets of Jerusalem… His prophecy certainly lies dead now.


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